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School holiday fines

Discussion in 'News and Politics' started by Steve, Apr 6, 2017.

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  1. Steve

    Steve Admin Community Supporter Meets Club Member Inner Sanctum Lotto Syndicate Member

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    Hi all,

    I noticed the news story today about one of the vast number of parents being fined for taking their children on holiday or to visit relatives or to a family event or whatever, and then being fined for it.

    As a parent, and a former School Governor, I liked the old rules on this best. They seemed fair all round and allowed parents to do the right thing when family events or trips of a lifetime or whatever came up.

    The current rules seem pretty stupid to me I have to say. The court today seemed to talk of parents needing to show obedience. A law that has seen the parents of dying children fined for taking them for a final holiday is totally absurd, isn't it?

    The children in my family are all missing a lot of school this year to go on pointless holidays, which they could all well do without. Why???

    Well they all go on the school trips that the schools sell to parents, and they are normally in term time aren't they! The kids that can't afford to go continue to have to go to school I believe.

    Schools likewise sell all sorts of alternative experiences to their pupils and these see them taken out of important subjects like Maths to be taught Electric Guitar or whatever... does this sit well with parents being criminals if they don't send their kids to every moment of every lesson?

    Schools also seem to have a number of fun days each year where they do no lessons. If such time is not needed for them to be taught why you have to wonder are they being forced to go to school with criminal penalties involved for them to not study?

    So, what a mixed up stupid sets of rules and ideas...

    Not quite as nutty perhaps as the ideas of the Labour Leader on schools this week.... he wants us to spend another £1 billion a year we do not have on more free meals for children.

    Almost all parents can afford to feed their children perfectly well, and do so. That means we are simply throwing away a massive amount of money and we have to borrow it to do so. If any parent truly hasn't got enough money to feed their child then give them a tax credit or whatever to solve that, don't go giving the vast mass of us free food we don't need... and in most cases really don't want.

    School dinners do tend to be trashy food at the end of the day, don't they... I remember mine, and I used to not eat the gunk being served most days, and so was very hungry most of the time. Thank God we had tuck shops back then so I could at least get some calories in me. Children in my family now refuse to eat a good 90% of the food available in their schools as it seems so unpleasant to them, eating one school meal per week or similar.

    So, madness.... and typical of Labour and its leader of late. He seems to have put out that idea looking for headlines and seeking hatred of those who save the taxpayer a fortune paying for their kids educations and save the rest of us from doing so. He tied the two together by saying there should be VAT on private school education. Charging VAT on child related items is normally seen as wrong by most decent people I think.

    Anyone else have a view?

    Steve

    PS: The BBC News item on this is HERE

    ...as you can see there. Scotland and Wales take a more sensible view. Also it seems so do most teachers. Was this perhaps introduced by a fool...
     
  2. Walter

    Walter Community Supporter Meets Club Member

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    When was at school which was in the 1948 onward was very lucky if I was taken to Brighton BB let alone trips aboard and all was in school holyday time.

    Fine the parents at least twice the savings they make by taken the children on holyday in term time.

    Exceptions funerals and sickness.

    Ok I will get off my soap book.

    Walter
     
  3. Steve

    Steve Admin Community Supporter Meets Club Member Inner Sanctum Lotto Syndicate Member

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    Walter,

    I remember a school trip to Belgium. I learnt nothing from it of course and just had fun on the beach etc. Teachers have to be on the school trips of course, and they tend not to work doing school holidays. I presume selling the holidays may provide funds for the school and free or low cost holidays for the teachers.

    People say this stuff about parents making savings... in fact it is the awful firms who sell holidays and put the prices up to many times the normal rate during all school holidays who are to blame for all the problems surrounding that. A law to not allow increased charges during school breaks might make a lot more sense really.

    The very high prices during school breaks simply mean millions of kids do not get a holiday or get to see the World...

    We had a close relative die the other day and one of the things that prevented us attending the funeral was that it is a school holiday... so making the cost of the trip impossibly high compared to normal.

    There are some problems that need sorting... none of them is sorted out by this very silly law, brought into place by a man I think most folks would agree seems to have an evil - stab everyone in the back - streak.

    Steve
     
  4. Walter

    Walter Community Supporter Meets Club Member

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    Steve,
    I agree
     
  5. Bob

    Bob Community Supporter Meets Club Member Lotto Syndicate Member

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    I haven't studied this subject properly, but it seems that the rules only apply to children at State schools.

    The inference that one has to deduce from that is that the quality of tuition at private schools must be significantly higher than the quality of tuition at State schools if it is so important that students at the State schools miss absolutely no time in the classroom yet those in private schools can afford to miss a little if their parents beel it is right for them to go away in term time...

    So, why can't the State schools get the tuition up to the standard of the private schools?

    :)

    Bob
     
  6. Walter

    Walter Community Supporter Meets Club Member

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    Bob,
    I expect there are fewer pupils to teacher ratio in a private school than in a state school.

    My 2nd cousin was a teacher in a state school and she had 40 pupils per class.

    Walter
     
  7. Steve

    Steve Admin Community Supporter Meets Club Member Inner Sanctum Lotto Syndicate Member

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    I've not studied all the laws and wordings and the folks who wrote them and who have to enforce them seem very unsure about the current laws and what they really mean anyway.

    My understanding, for what its worth, is that it is up to parents to provide a full time education for their children and they can do it in many different ways.

    Home schooling and boarding schools and private schools and state schools or whatever. Whatever they choose they must though I believe ensure it is full time and that their children are in full time education, and attending every school day, at certain ages.

    I know some Web sites say private schools are exempt, I suspect that is a simplification of the true position.

    One Web site on the law on such things is here: http://childlawadvice.org.uk/information-pages/school-attendance-and-absence/ A quick look there didn't help me a lot but it is fairly clearly written from the look of it.

    I think bringing private schools into the frame as somehow bad guys is simple class war, and as such is simply a cheap shot by Labour anyway. They wanted to tax private education to pay for more free meals for families often earning a fortune. My local state school has a number of Bentley's outside it in the morning and the local price of a Semi Detached House is over £600k... the idea of us giving all those kids free meals they don't need or want or like, and borrowing the money to do it is so dumb and one of many reasons why Labour really must get rid of that pathetic leader of theirs.

    I think the teachers are much the same from my limited experience with such things. I know my old all boys state grammar school had great teachers wandering around in their cloaks and hats and I don't believe there were better ones in the local private schools. We used to love beating them in various ways.

    I don't believe Head Teachers, Teachers, and experts in education do generally think our kids need to be in school every minute of the term, particularly when in Junior school. They seem to want up to 2 weeks that can be allowed if the Head Teacher feels it is sensible and approves it.

    Looking at why Gove argued for the new law I see that the fact that younger kids were taking more time off than older ones was his justification. The man seems clueless in so many ways - of course parents are happier taking youngsters out of school on days when the day was going to consist of watching a movie or whatever.. but when the kids were older and studying hard they took them out much less often.

    I've never personally thought that was an issue or a problem. I like that the UK allows people freedom to choose how to educate their kids and although I have never attended a private school or sent a child to one I fully support those who want to.

    I have visited many of the private schools in the UK and sold them this and that. I have to say I loved being inside those places. They usually have great standards, great traditions, great people generally working in them who are so proud to be there, etc. The same goes for the top universities or hospitals etc.

    One problem is that many councils are truly awful. They are closing everything, failing to invest in things like schools, failing to collect the rubbish even. Letting those fools be involved in any way with the education of children is absurd really.

    In this area our council has not increased its charges for over a decade I believe. It has rebuilt all 17 of our local libraries and they are now very swish. New schools are being built and old ones refurbished, etc. etc. Rubbish collection is perfect and weekly, the roads are currently all being resurfaced and pavements relayed. All town centres are being refreshed, etc. etc. The council has won more green flags then any other. A good council can make all the difference - age 65 in this area you get a free burglar alarm, free swimming, parking concessions, and lots more.

    Steve